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TAfirehawk
09-12-2010, 08:50 PM
Forum and Organizational Changes
Communications Department



The SWGEmu PreCU Emulator Project has been Open Source since 2007, and in that time we've seen over a dozen developers use that open door to contribute their visions to the game and its code. We now recognise that while the project's code has been open to change, the project as a body - as a community - has been less open to change. This is a situation that the Team is committed to fixing.


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Voicing Your Concerns

We welcome your advice, your ideas and a wider community consensus. By opening up the concerns@swgemu.com email address for concerns about staff or management issues, we are hoping to resolve isolated incidents before they become real issues. Eventually a web based form will be implemented to direct concerns to the appropriate people. Emails about support issues will not be answered from this email address. Threads discussing the overall nature, direction or history of the project are permitted within the revised Forum Rules and the revised Infraction system.

The concerns@swgemu.com email address goes to the Communications Director and Manager only as those positions are serving in a Human Resources role as well as official communications. We hope this provides an efficient means for concerns about staff or management issues, but please continue to use support email addresses. For those cases when the concern is directed at the Communications Department, the comms-concerns@swgemu.com email address goes to the President and Test Center Director only. The use of these two email addresses will allow the person submitting the concern to have anonymity when requested, while still providing a means to convey all the details to the right people on Staff.


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Forum Rules and Infraction System

The Forum Rules (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18261) have been updated to clarify them for everybody. Each rule now has an assigned infraction point value and duration. With the updated Infraction System (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17538), infractions will only be lifted when the infraction time has expired, ban only removed when the ban period is completed, and permanent bans are in fact permanent and final. This system will be applied to ALL members of the Community and Staff. Please read through the rules and infraction system carefully as this is in effect immediately.

Forum Rules Update Highlights

Item 1.1 has a link for help with account issues and requests for multiple accounts.
Item 2.4 has been updated, "Troll posts or threads. We define troll posts and threads as those which knowingly lead to inflammatory or off-topic messages with the intent of A) provoking other users into a desired emotional response or B) disrupting normal on-topic discussion."
Some guidelines/rules were removed.

Infraction System Update Highlights

New point levels and durations for each rule
Removal of 0 point warnings, they are now 1 demerit point
New punishment levels based on accumulated points: warning (1 point), 3 day ban (2 points), 3 week ban (3 points), 3 month ban (4 points) and permanent ban (5 points)


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Test Center Exploit Testing Policy

The Test Center rules pertaining to testing, reporting and use of exploits has been updated. We hope to make it clear that we want to get all exploits reported and as long as you report them without further use, there will be no penalty or infraction points given.

3.12 The SWGEmu Team encourages the reporting of any and all exploits. You are required to immediately report and discontinue use of all discovered exploits or face disciplinary action listed below.


3.12.1 Exploits include, but are not limited to; all forms of hacking, exploiting and all other actions intended to break, bend or in anyway alter the SWGEmu gameplay experience in favor of one player or against another player.
3.12.2 Report all exploits to the Quality Assurance department at http://www.swgemu.com/bugs using the Exploit category or send to quality@swgemu.com
3.12.3 As a first offence, there will be a warning issued directing the guilty party to the Quality Assurance department. Offenders are required to immediately disclose all known information about the exploit. Failure to comply with this policy will result in an immediate permanent ban from all SWGEmu services. This ban will include the immediate deletion of all known characters, items, disbanding of guilds if guild leader, and removal of all items being sold by the user on the marketplace.



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Official Communications

Official Communications




The official announcement banner above will be used on all official communications at the top of the post. This will help clarify "official" vs. "non-official" posting by Staff members.


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The Object Restructure and New Website are Coming

As stated in the End of Summer Update (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70615), the long awaited Object Restructure code is coming to TC: Nova soon. As often happens with volunteer projects, SWGEmu is no exception, we are behind on our projected goals for releasing the OR. Our staff can only volunteer so much time, and non-development issues have occupied a substantial amount of that time in recent weeks. Our efforts have been refocused and the Developers are pushing to get you the best testing experience in the shortest amount of time for the OR to be put full time on TC: Nova. We truly wish we had a good estimate but as has been stated many times, estimated times are very difficult in a volunteer project.

We have more in store than the OR code on TC: Nova, work has made significant progress towards a single account management system that registers in all SWGEmu services. This means you will have to register just once to gain access to TC: Nova, forums, IRC and the bug tracker.


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Wiping the Slate Clean

The new account management system and new forum software means a complete reset on your accounts. The new registration page will check the old forum database for names and passwords so your unique name will be reserved just for you, but you can also choose a new name if you wish.

For the community, there is also an unexpected benefit from our infrastructure upgrade. We will not be transferring any of the bans or infractions to the new forums or IRC server. This means that everyone gets a final chance to start fresh in being a valuable contributor to help us bring back the game that was taken away. This will be the last time we wipe our infractions before the eventual release of 1.0 and your infractions and bans may carry over to SunCrusher.

Please be aware that the updated Forum Rules (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18261) and Infraction System (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17538) will be used on the new forums and this will be STRONGLY and FAIRLY enforced.


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Organizational Changes

The organizational chart (http://docs.google.com/fileview?id=0B4u-IIuMfONHZTU4YTUwZjQtOTg4My00MWZkLTk5YmUtZGI5OWY1ND AxN2Ji&hl=en&authkey=CI2M56oL) has been updated to better reflect the structure and chain of command for the SWGEmu Team. The major changes include the position of the Founders being added and the moving of the Communications Department out from the Test Center division.


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TAfirehawk
09-12-2010, 08:50 PM
SWGEmu Website Terms of Service
Updated September 12, 2010
Communications Department



1. ACCOUNT GUIDELINES

SWGEmu Accounts are used to access the SWGEmu Network, including but not limited to: the SWGEmu Forums, Website, Test Center(s), Bug Tracker and IRC Server. All SWGEmu Users must follow the following rules in respect to their SWGEmu Account:


1.1 Multiple SWGEmu Accounts are not permitted. Each user may only have one account. Measures are incorporated to detect multiple user accounts. Please see the Account Issues Policy (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53615) for help. 3 points, never expires
1.2 SWGEmu Accounts are non-transferable. Registered users are responsible for any actions that take place on their accounts or private messaging systems. 2 points, never expires
1.3 If you are banned, it is not permitted to get back to the SWGEmu Network on an alternate account. You may contact an SWGEmu Community Manager to discuss the nature of your ban and its duration via email or private message. Email community@swgemu.com if you feel a ban has been issue unfairly.
1.4 You may not attempt to acquire a password, other account information, or other private information from a Member or any other user on the SWGEmu Network. Remember: SWGEmu staff members will NEVER ask for your password. Do not give out your password to anyone. 4 points, never expires
1.5 Users under the age of 13 may only create an account to access the SWGEmu Network with the expressed permission of their Parent / Guardian under the Children's Online Privacy Protection Act 1998.
1.6 Account names and all subsequent user names must be appropriate and must not conflict with the Conduct Guidelines or Use Policy of the service in which the user name is involved. Inappropriate naming conventions are covered in, but not limited to, the subjects mentioned in section 2.7 of this document. 1 point, expires in 12 months
1.7 All account and hence user activity on the SWGEmu Test Center(s) are subject to the SWGEmu Test Center Rules and Policies, not transcribed in this document. Please view our rules portal at http://www.swgemu.com/rules to view the said document.



2. WEBSITE AND FORUM CONDUCT GUIDELINES

In the interest of maintaining a constructive and equal environment for everyone, all users of the SWGEmu Forums and Website may not:


2.1 Post, transmit, promote, or distribute Content that is illegal. 3 points, never expires
2.2 Harass, threaten, or making personal attacks against another Member or guest. This includes: repeatedly sending them unwanted messages, attacking their race, sexual orientation, religion, heritage, and cussing or insulting them personally. 1 point, expires in 6 months
2.3 Transmit or facilitate distribution of Content (including images or videos) that is harmful, abusive, racially or ethnically offensive, or overtly sexual. 2 points, expires in 24 months
2.4 Troll posts or threads. We define troll posts and threads as those which knowingly lead to inflammatory or off-topic messages with the intent of A) provoking other users into a desired emotional response or B) disrupting normal on-topic discussion. 1 point, expires in 9 months
2.5 Posts that have been removed are not to be reposted. 2 points, expires in 12 months
2.6 Impersonate another person (including celebrities), indicate falsely that you are a SWGEmu Staff Member or a representative of any other community, or attempt to mislead users by indicating that you represent SWGEmu or any of SWGEmu's affiliates. 3 points, expires in 24 months
2.7 Upload any software or Content that you do not own or have permission to freely distribute. 3 points, expires in 24 months
2.8 Promote or encourage any illegal activity including hacking, "web raiding" or distribution of counterfeit software. 3 points, expires in 24 months
2.9 Upload files that contain a virus or corrupted data. 5 points, never expires
2.10 Modify any part of the SWGEmu Network Service or any SWGEmu website that the SWGEmu Team does not specifically authorize you to modify. 5 points, never expires
2.11 Post any user’s real-world personal information without his or her expressed permission. 3 points, expires in 18 months
2.12 Attempt to interfere with, hack into to or disrupt functionality from the servers which contribute to the SWGEmu Network. 5 points, never expires
2.13 Spam, defined as the re-posting of content repeatedly. 1 point, expires in 2 weeks
2.14 Advertise or attempt to sell products for profit. Only products authorised by SWGEmu may be advertised for sale. 1 point, expires in 3 months
2.15 Modify, Copy, Rerelease, Edit or Change the Design, Content or Imagery featured on the SWGEmu Website and Forums. The code base for the SWGEmu Website is the proprietary property of the WiseMon Team. The SWGEmu Forum code base is the proprietary property of Jellsoft Enterprises Ltd. 3 points, expires in 24 months
2.16 Promote, Advise the use of or use yourself the Star Wars Galaxies Trial Client, Digital Download, or any other illegal client versions, to connect to the SWGEmu Test Centre(s). Only legitimate, physical commercial versions of Star Wars Galaxies may be used. 3 points, expires in 24 months

TAfirehawk
09-12-2010, 08:51 PM
SWGEmu Infraction System
Updated September 12, 2010
Communications Department



Free speech and the necessity of fair discussion are held in the highest regard, however when the line between debate and brawl is crossed, it is the job of the Staff to regulate so that the standards of the community are maintained for all. At times, anybody can "get off track" so we have to make sure the primary focus is for Development to return to us the game we love, Star Wars Galaxies Pre-Combat Upgrade.


The SWGEmu Infraction System is a system employed by SWGEmu to keep track of trouble makers and alert them that their actions are inappropriate. It is used for infractions on the Forums and TC, or occasionally on IRC.

The system operates based on a tally of demerit points. Each user has a personal point count (beginning at 0 upon registration). Points are global across all networks: a point awarded for a forum flame war has the same weight as a point awarded for abusing a Test Center player, and they contribute to the same total.

The infraction system incorporates three key elements:

Infractions are given for violating any of the listed Website Terms of Service (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18261). These are worth specific points assigned by the system automatically. Each rule lists the associated point value and duration to expiration of that incident's points. They are also archived for reference.
Bans are not simply handed out by Staff but are done automatically by the system. Once it has been determined that a rule has been broken, then there is no choice but to assign the associated infraction points. Only when the tally of demerit points equals a Ban level will a person receive a ban.
As points accumulate, bans are imposed by the system automatically. The first point has no ban associated with it and should be treated as a warning. A total of 2 points incurs a 3 day ban. As points increase beyond 2, so does the ban length. 3 points equal a 3 week ban and 4 points equal a 3 month ban. When 5 points has been accumulated, expired points do not count in the total, a permanent ban is given that will never expire.


The Moderator staff that can give infractions can't set the number of points or duration. They only may choose from a pre-determined list where each rule violation comes with just one point value and duration option. The points or duration will ONLY be changed by official changes to this document and not for personal reasons. This is done to make the Infraction System clear and fair for everybody.

On the forums, infractions aren't given for things like swearing in one post, making a thread answered in the FAQ, or any of the other countless daily mistakes made by young and old: rather infractions are more commonly awarded for continuous negativity, personal attacks, "flame wars", and cross-thread brawling.
The Test Center follows the same philosophy. For most minor TC rule offenses - improper names, spamming etc warnings are given. It is uncommon for infractions to be given in response to IRC behavior.

Each infraction has an expiry date set by the system automatically. Generally infractions have a 3-12 month expiry. After an infraction has expired, the point(s) no longer count towards a users tally of demerit points. When an infraction is awarded, a Private Message is sent to the User explaining the reason for the infraction, as well as stipulating if the user was awarded a ban with that infraction.

We hope this allows everyone to be on the same page. We don't go around banning people willy nilly at a whim, and 95% of people will never need to know what an infraction is. But for the sake of clarity and transparency we felt it was important to let everyone know how we deal with trouble makers.

Max
09-13-2010, 04:26 AM
Forum and Organizational Changes
Clarification Points
Communications Department


Revisions

2.13 Spam, defined as the re-posting of content repeatedly. Spam includes QFE's without explanation, +1's, Bumps, blatantly off topic posts and "In Before Lock"s. 1 point, expires in 2 weeks has been revised to 2.13 Spam, defined as the re-posting of content repeatedly. 1 point, expires in 2 weeks. All infractions given based on the old incarnation of this rule have been reversed.


Points of Clarification:


The new account management system comes along with new versions of all our services.
The new account management system will allow the separation of infraction points so all our services will have their own, independent tally of demerit points and independent bans.
The old forums will be archived so useful posts can be brought into the new forum easily by Staff.
Those that currently have multiple accounts at the same location, we don't have it tested yet, but you will eventually be able to continue with approved multiple accounts.
"Impersonate another person (including celebrities)" is so people don't hide behind a name or account that is not their own.
The policies and rules listed in this announcement are effective immediately to all users registered on this site.
Your account name can only be changed when the new site is released. This will likely be with the release of the OR to TC: Nova but we will not hold up the OR release waiting on the site to be finished.


We welcome everybody's comments and feedback, but as the first item in the Announcement says, "concerns" are to be handled through concerns@swgemu.com and not on this forum.

The good questions to clarify things will be posted back into the "reserved" posts so it is easier for everybody to see the answers.


Everything we are trying to do is to help development bring back the game that was taken away from us. The choice is yours and yours alone to choose if you want to contribute in a positive manner or wish to be hurtful to the Development Project. Anything from anybody that detracts from the best environment for development, like trolling or any other rule breaking, will not be tolerated because we will not be losing more development time to forum or TC drama again. And YES, anybody includes all Staff, every single person registered on this forum.


The rules are set and apply immediately to this forum and TC: Nova (IRC rules have not been updated yet). Because this is a change in policy for Staff too, there may be some inconsistency for a few days. I ask you to be patient and please bring up any issues in a professional manner and any wrongs will be corrected.

Please follow the rules in all threads and be responsible in reporting possible rule violations. We don't have a staff large enough to patrol every single thread on this forum so we all have to work together to make this a better place for development.

bazweller
09-13-2010, 07:26 AM
Nice, I like the new ideas and additions!

Vlada
09-13-2010, 07:46 AM
Interesting.

One question...

The new account management system and new forum software

Means just that or new forums too?

Joshino
09-13-2010, 07:53 AM
2.13 Spam, defined as the re-posting of content repeatedly. Spam includes QFE's without explanation, +1's, Bumps, blatantly off topic posts and "In Before Lock"s.
No way these are the corner stones to a healthy forum.

2.16 Promote, Advise the use of or use yourself the Digital Download
This ones a bit harsh? An instant ban for advising to use the digital client... its a commen mistake to think that its ok.

Also all the expiry dates are out of wack, half a year for reposting something? I lol'd.

Impersonate another person (including celebrities)
lol what is this?

2.14 Advertise or attempt to sell products for profit. Only products authorised by SWGEmu may be advertised for sale. 1 point, expires in 3 months

Why does this have a longer expiry time than harassment or reposting deleted messages?

Max
09-13-2010, 08:01 AM
Interesting.

One question...



Means just that or new forums too?
Vlada,

We're upgrading to vBulletin 4. We thought that would be a good opportunity to advance our plans for a central account management system. Unfortunately it is simply too hard (and potentially unstable) to migrate the whole forums from the current v3 to v4, hence we have to take what we need and archive the rest.

You will have to register again at the new site, but when you register as Vlada it will ask for your old password and copy all your old info over. This way, no one will lose their name in the move.

So in one line: both. Hope that answers your question.

Cheers

Vlada
09-13-2010, 08:13 AM
Vlada,

We're upgrading to vBulletin 4. We thought that would be a good opportunity to advance our plans for a central account management system. Unfortunately it is simply too hard (and potentially unstable) to migrate the whole forums from the current v3 to v4, hence we have to take what we need and archive the rest.

You will have to register again at the new site, but when you register as Vlada it will ask for your old password and copy all your old info over. This way, no one will lose their name in the move.

So in one line: both. Hope that answers your question.

Cheers

What about old guides, profession section, screenshots etc? There is a lot of knowledge not to mention memories there, it would be a shame to lose all that.

You will archive old forums, but what about re-posting those threads? Would that be an option later?

Max
09-13-2010, 08:16 AM
What about old guides, profession section, screenshots etc? There is a lot of knowledge not to mention memories there, it would be a shame to lose all that.

You will archive old forums, but what about re-posting those threads? Would that be an option later?
Yes, that's the plan. We'll have an archive of the forums so you can repost anything we need (which is obviously a lot - guides, info, collaborations etc).

I don't know if an automatic mechanism is possible, but you'll certainly be able to copy/paste. Its a pain to be sure, but it may just be a technical concern.

Vlada
09-13-2010, 08:19 AM
Yes, that's the plan. We'll have an archive of the forums so you can repost anything we need (which is obviously a lot - guides, info, collaborations etc).

Great, thanks.

That's all i needed to know. :)

Elvaron
09-13-2010, 08:48 AM
Be honest Vlada, the Don Quijote of Don Quijotes, you cant wait to have to write new guides and stuff! I bet it's getting boring to just have a repertoire of replies and links for each and every request on the forums?

@Joshino: On 2.16: Don't take my word on this (notice the missing official comm banner? :D), but I would assume there's a difference between a new member asking whether it was allowed, and, let's say, Vlada deciding that he would from now on tell everyone who asks to use the digital download version. There's a legal issue involved, I believe. On your other concerns I can't really commit, because I dont know, and I don't think fighting over infraction expiry periods is worth more than fighting windmills. Most people will never experience expiry periods to be an issue for them.

reelforjake
09-13-2010, 10:45 AM
If we decide to change our account name, will the system still be able to transfer old info or will it essentially be creating a new account from scratch?

Max
09-13-2010, 11:01 AM
If we decide to change our account name, will the system still be able to transfer old info or will it essentially be creating a new account from scratch?
If you change your accout name, it won't be able to transfer over the old info, but considering you're after a new account name - is this really an issue? All you would be missing would be profile info, join date etc.

michaeljs1990
09-13-2010, 11:12 AM
Sorry if i missed it but i could not find when it was going into effect. Is this going to be around the same time as the OR?

KillerQueen
09-13-2010, 11:17 AM
When are they switching to the new forums? Will this be soon or just something planned in the distant future?

Reken
09-13-2010, 11:35 AM
Max,

What effect will these changes have regarding two accounts out of one home? My brother and I are both registered users and I have submitted an email with our info to avoid a ban a year ago. Will we have to resubmit our info if we keep the same account names?

BigEvil
09-13-2010, 11:36 AM
Max,

What effect will these changes have regarding two accounts out of one home? My brother and I are both registered users and I have submitted an email with our info to avoid a ban a year ago. Will we have to resubmit our info if we keep the same account names?

Good question Reken. Same here with me and the wife.

michaeljs1990
09-13-2010, 11:40 AM
from what i get it looks like unless they lift the ban on two accounts for a short time for the registration one of the accounts will most likely be banned for the time being.

Reken
09-13-2010, 11:43 AM
from what i get it looks like unless they lift the ban on two accounts for a short time for the registration one of the accounts will most likely be banned for the time being.

We are not banned. I was concerned with the changes regarding the detection software they use to avoid being banned.

Kyle
09-13-2010, 11:45 AM
Max,

What effect will these changes have regarding two accounts out of one home? My brother and I are both registered users and I have submitted an email with our info to avoid a ban a year ago. Will we have to resubmit our info if we keep the same account names?

It may take a little extra work to get both registered, like the first time, but we will certainly have no problem with people that have legitimate multi-accounts in a household.

michaeljs1990
09-13-2010, 11:46 AM
sry if i wasnt clear i know you are not banned atm im saying when you reapply one account will most likely get banned

Reken
09-13-2010, 12:10 PM
It may take a little extra work to get both registered, like the first time, but we will certainly have no problem with people that have legitimate multi-accounts in a household.

Thanks for the response, Kyle. When the change comes, I will make sure my account is active and then submit a new email with our info.

PhantomLeader
09-13-2010, 12:50 PM
Also all the expiry dates are out of wack, half a year for reposting something? I lol'd.

The long expiry dates are to keep users from 'playing the system'. We found with the old system certain users would rack up enough infractions to get a day or two ban, let the points 'cool off' if you will due to short expiration times, then do it all over again. This lead to several users getting a slap on the wrist over and over and over again. The long expiration times give more weight to the infraction system, whereas a short expiration makes it into a little game.

2.14 Advertise or attempt to sell products for profit. Only products authorised by SWGEmu may be advertised for sale. 1 point, expires in 3 months

Why does this have a longer expiry time than harassment or reposting deleted messages?

It doesn't.

When are they switching to the new forums? Will this be soon or just something planned in the distant future?

Sorry if i missed it but i could not find when it was going into effect. Is this going to be around the same time as the OR?

Some of the stuff is already in effect, such as the new rules and infraction system.

As for the forums, they're coming at the same time as the account management system, which is coming at the same time as the OR. Unfortunately an exact date is impossible, but we're trying to have it all done as soon as possible.

Joshino
09-13-2010, 01:06 PM
The long expiry dates are to keep users from 'playing the system'. We found with the old system certain users would rack up enough infractions to get a day or two ban, let the points 'cool off' if you will due to short expiration times, then do it all over again. This lead to several users getting a slap on the wrist over and over and over again. The long expiration times give more weight to the infraction system, whereas a short expiration makes it into a little game.



It doesn't.

Basically you just want to get rid of some people and have no real reason to, ok sounds good.

Aslo YES it does, 6months vs 3months, anyone can read and confirm what it says in the post? Apparently you can't.

Joshino
09-13-2010, 01:09 PM
No way these are the corner stones to a healthy forum.


This ones a bit harsh? An instant ban for advising to use the digital client... its a commen mistake to think that its ok.

Also all the expiry dates are out of wack, half a year for reposting something? I lol'd.


lol what is this?



Why does this not have a longer expiry time than harassment or reposting deleted messages?

Seeing as a you can't edit posts in here this is what I actually meant, however the point is valid, why would that warrant less of an infraction time? Somebody trying to sell something on this site.

SomeoneImportant
09-13-2010, 01:09 PM
cute stuff

Supa
09-13-2010, 01:19 PM
Not a huge fan of the vB4 look, but it's definitely a step up from vB3 security wise. I managed to try it out myself locally, and, for the most parts, the ACP is exactly the same.

Kyle
09-13-2010, 01:35 PM
Not a huge fan of the vB4 look, but it's definitely a step up from vB3 security wise. I managed to try it out myself locally, and, for the most parts, the ACP is exactly the same.

The look is only as good as the theme designed. The default look is bland and boring, but we won't be sticking to the default.

Newsound
09-13-2010, 01:44 PM
looking forward to it. love progress :)

Raiden Nar
09-13-2010, 01:45 PM
Can not wait! Got to having somthing to do when im bored at home. No point of playing on TC cause of the WIPE!!!

Uli
09-13-2010, 02:44 PM
I'm curious to see how long this lasts, considering how many parts of the forums never get moderated full stop.

jacoblovingood
09-13-2010, 04:48 PM
How do you change your account name anyway?

Noktus
09-13-2010, 05:05 PM
How do you change your account name anyway?

Just being helpful but it says in the long original post that when the new forum website is online you will have to re-apply to those forums.

When you re-apply to the new forums you do not have to use the same name for those new forums as no info will be transferred automatically unless you re-register under the same log-in name.

Again just being helpful and only highlighting what they already said.

Vlada
09-13-2010, 05:08 PM
How do you change your account name anyway?

You asked me that some ten days ago, did you even check your visitor messages?

Back on topic, you will be able to register under a different name once new forum is up.

kaidang
09-13-2010, 06:10 PM
I say Great Job!! Just happy to be playing SWG again. I appreciate all those volunteers for their hard work and personal time spent in making us a game we can come to love once again. Everytime I log on here i see something better for us...... Again awesome job keep up the good work.

sixdeath
09-13-2010, 06:13 PM
Can not wait! Got to having somthing to do when im bored at home. No point of playing on TC cause of the WIPE!!!

you can test on the TC because of a wipe?

kaidang
09-13-2010, 06:17 PM
The wipe has an estimated time. Keep playing on NOVA and testing the OR thats what we are supposed to be doing. The wipe may not come for a while, these guys are working hard on fixing stuff so just enjoy what we have. If we all quit playing because a wipe is coming, whats the point. Just keep playing, wipe or no wipe.

Slayer45
09-13-2010, 06:29 PM
It may take a little extra work to get both registered, like the first time, but we will certainly have no problem with people that have legitimate multi-accounts in a household.

I hope not too much time and aggravation because Myself and my two nephews live in the same house and it was a pain for me to get them set up the first time.

Kolo.M
09-13-2010, 06:59 PM
i have to agree with some here in that the expiration times seem way too long. there is short and there is long and then there is way too long. most of those expiry times are way too long. even if a troller gets slapped over and over again. a three month suspension would work for that troublemaker. i mean, who is gonna remember him after 3 months?
i think the expiry dates should be 3 months and 6 months max. naturally the permanent bans are permanent.
but if someone does some really stupid stuff here, i think a 6 month spanking would be appropriate. not friggen 2 years. and boy do those points add up fast in the new system, especially with 2 year expiry dates!

Nedak
09-13-2010, 07:13 PM
Good job, guys.

Elvaron
09-13-2010, 07:31 PM
i have to agree with some here in that the expiration times seem way too long. there is short and there is long and then there is way too long. most of those expiry times are way too long. even if a troller gets slapped over and over again. a three month suspension would work for that troublemaker. i mean, who is gonna remember him after 3 months?
i think the expiry dates should be 3 months and 6 months max. naturally the permanent bans are permanent.
but if someone does some really stupid stuff here, i think a 6 month spanking would be appropriate. not friggen 2 years. and boy do those points add up fast in the new system, especially with 2 year expiry dates!

You realize that the expiry date does not equal the punishment right? I don't see anything with an expiry date of 2 years that gives more than 3 points and that is a 3 weeks ban, not a 2 year ban. And all of those are serious offenses. As in real-world illegal.

Aramis Lionel
09-13-2010, 07:40 PM
Very nicely explained and straight forward rule set:)

Kolo.M
09-13-2010, 08:30 PM
ya but the POINTS last for 1 year and 2 years. thats the point. you can never get out from under those points. and they do add up to 5 REALLY FAST. so after your 4 point 3 month suspension, you have to basically be a really good boy for 21 months to avoid the permanent ban on your 5th point. like 6 months later and you make a small mistake and get 1 point and then are BANNED FOR LIFE, as it is your 5th point.
thats what i mean by long expiry dates. you may have forgotten what you did 6 months ago and then you get walloped with permaban on a small infraction.

Kolo.M
09-13-2010, 08:36 PM
my point is this, if you pay the price for your misdeed, like 3 month suspension, then the points that incurred that penalty should be then wiped. not hanging over your head for the next 21 months.
think about it, you are sitting with 4 points and you get 1 more point for trolling. and by your definition, trolling can mean most anything. i got accused of trolling by making a sardonic reply to a post in a thread that i was already in the discussion on.
that would be a 1 pointer for a quick comment and for that 4 point guy, HE GETS BANNED FOR LIFE on something said in a small post.

Elvaron
09-13-2010, 08:41 PM
ya but the POINTS last for 1 year and 2 years. thats the point. you can never get out from under those points. and they do add up to 5 REALLY FAST. so after your 4 point 3 month suspension, you have to basically be a really good boy for 21 months to avoid the permanent ban on your 5th point. like 6 months later and you make a small mistake and get 1 point and then are BANNED FOR LIFE, as it is your 5th point.
thats what i mean by long expiry dates. you may have forgotten what you did 6 months ago and then you get walloped with permaban on a small infraction.

Well, you know the rules now, just behave by them and you dont get any of those infraction points. Also, the only 4 points rule I see is to try and get someone's account data. Seriously, you want people trying to get into your account get less punished? Serious offense => serious punishment. Back to you.

TAfirehawk
09-13-2010, 08:42 PM
We welcome everybody's comments and feedback, but as the first item in the Announcement says, "concerns" are to be handled through concerns@swgemu.com and not on this forum.

The good questions to clarify things will be posted back into the "reserved" posts so it is easier for everybody to see the answers.


Everything we are trying to do is to help development bring back the game that was taken away from us. The choice is yours and yours alone to choose if you want to contribute in a positive manner or wish to be hurtful to the Development Project. Anything from anybody that detracts from the best environment for development, like trolling or any other rule breaking, will not be tolerated because we will not be losing more development time to forum or TC drama again. And YES, anybody includes all Staff, every single person registered on this forum.


The rules are set and apply immediately to this forum and TC: Nova (IRC rules have not been updated yet). Because this is a change in policy for Staff too, there may be some inconsistency for a few days. I ask you to be patient and please bring up any issues in a professional manner and any wrongs will be corrected.

Please follow the rules in all threads and be responsible in reporting possible rule violations. We don't have a staff large enough to patrol every single thread on this forum so we all have to work together to make this a better place for development.

Gelasius
09-13-2010, 11:11 PM
do the forum infractions like trolling, bumping, +1 etc... when added up to a ban will that be only to the forums or logging into the game as well? and bumping is a forum infraction???? we all do that on the trade forum.

Dngrzne91
09-14-2010, 01:40 AM
do the forum infractions like trolling, bumping, +1 etc... when added up to a ban will that be only to the forums or logging into the game as well? and bumping is a forum infraction???? we all do that on the trade forum.

AMG it's Asher.

fixit6
09-14-2010, 02:05 AM
Really, about time. Forums have degenerated incredibly over the past year, my only thoughts are to have a PvP forum section so all the trolls can have their 'fun' there.

One question....with auto infractions, would this not be open to abuse? ie. one guild hates the other so they just slam on report all day long with all their mates.

Lastly, really....I would think that the average poster who doesn't resort to troll like replies: you really shouldn't have much of a problem, if at all.

brandonbp
09-14-2010, 03:14 AM
We welcome everybody's comments and feedback

Seems this isn't the case.

http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72552

Thread closed. No troll. No rules violated. Just closed.

Sorry if I didn't ask the right question or was too gungho about playing the game. I suppose us fans shouldn't get too excited about playing. I'll be more low key and act as if I don't like the project next time.

I don't much like this game. How about you guys? I hope it takes forever to get the OR started. Being a member since 2006, I'm obviously not a big fan of the project since I've been lurking for a mere four years. Damn, why did I act so excited about the OR? I knew I shouldn't have been excited. I knew it wasn't allowed in these forums yet I still acted excited. Dammit. What in the mother of all hell was I thinking?

Sorry to be excited.

I don't expect this post to stay up long since it doesn't say the right things or kiss any of the mod's butts.

fixit6
09-14-2010, 03:24 AM
You made a thread, essentially...demanding an OR eta which has been said many times there is none. No one knows, not even the hard working devs, CMs, and GMs.

They alerted us that the OR and wipe is soon already, there really is no need to have thread after thread asking when it will happen. I think that is why it was locked rather than anything else.

brandonbp
09-14-2010, 03:35 AM
You made a thread, essentially...demanding an OR eta which has been said many times there is none. No one knows, not even the hard working devs, CMs, and GMs.

They alerted us that the OR and wipe is soon already, there really is no need to have thread after thread asking when it will happen. I think that is why it was locked rather than anything else.
If you read the post then you can see it was meant to be a rah rah sort of post about getting our Pre-CU game on. Not to disparage the work of the devs.

Also, I see lots of posts asking when the OR is going to hit and they aren't immediately closed.

I'm just ready to play the game. Man, I love love love this game and I wanna play. I, like the rest of you, was devastated when they took away the best game ever. I can't imagine how difficult it is to code this stuff to make it like the original. I'm not busting on the devs. I just wanted to tell the players in these forums that I'm so very excited to play and let's do this thing when it gets started.

Daijobu
09-14-2010, 05:14 AM
Very good, kepp it up : )
But how about puttin up a Wiki on the page, so Vlada und co can put their guides and co there. Easier to find, modify and manage. Just my 2 cents : )

Vlada
09-14-2010, 05:18 AM
do the forum infractions like trolling, bumping, +1 etc... when added up to a ban will that be only to the forums or logging into the game as well? and bumping is a forum infraction???? we all do that on the trade forum.

I'm not sure there that there will be a trade forum after the OR.

TAfirehawk
09-14-2010, 08:39 AM
do the forum infractions like trolling, bumping, +1 etc... when added up to a ban will that be only to the forums or logging into the game as well? and bumping is a forum infraction???? we all do that on the trade forum.

We will have to look at special forums like Trade Forums and General areas that will need relaxed rules. Our goal is to keep things orderly for development and those two areas I listed deserve a bit more freedom as they won't bother development.

We don't claim to be perfect in everything we say and we know some tweaking and adjusting might be needed so we always stay open to input.


Really, about time. Forums have degenerated incredibly over the past year, my only thoughts are to have a PvP forum section so all the trolls can have their 'fun' there.

One question....with auto infractions, would this not be open to abuse? ie. one guild hates the other so they just slam on report all day long with all their mates.

Lastly, really....I would think that the average poster who doesn't resort to troll like replies: you really shouldn't have much of a problem, if at all.

Infractions are still given by Moderators or Managers, but the point where the ban kicks in is automatic at the listed point levels. We don't adjust points for a given rule infraction.


Seems this isn't the case.

http://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72552

Thread closed. No troll. No rules violated. Just closed.

Sorry if I didn't ask the right question or was too gungho about playing the game. I suppose us fans shouldn't get too excited about playing. I'll be more low key and act as if I don't like the project next time.

I don't much like this game. How about you guys? I hope it takes forever to get the OR started. Being a member since 2006, I'm obviously not a big fan of the project since I've been lurking for a mere four years. Damn, why did I act so excited about the OR? I knew I shouldn't have been excited. I knew it wasn't allowed in these forums yet I still acted excited. Dammit. What in the mother of all hell was I thinking?

Sorry to be excited.

I don't expect this post to stay up long since it doesn't say the right things or kiss any of the mod's butts.

I haven't talked to IX but my guess is that your thread was viewed as "asking an ETA". Those typically get closed.

At the same time, I have asked everybody to take some time to adjust to the updated rules and infraction system and that includes Staff too.

Please address concerns about staff and management policy to concerns@swgemu.com


I'm not sure there that there will be a trade forum after the OR.

We will have one.

Valkyra
09-14-2010, 09:01 AM
AMG it's Asher.

I saw Krash post in a thread earlier too I was like OMG :eek:

Next up will be Elif.

Colest
09-14-2010, 12:02 PM
2.4 Troll posts or threads. We define troll posts and threads as those which knowingly lead to inflammatory or off-topic messages with the intent of A) provoking other users into a desired emotional response or B) disrupting normal on-topic discussion. 1 point, expires in 9 months
2.13 Spam, defined as the re-posting of content repeatedly. Spam includes QFE's without explanation, +1's, Bumps, blatantly off topic posts and "In Before Lock"s. 1 point, expires in 2 weeks

2 Weeks for spamming but 9 Months for trolling? I mean, I've seen Mods troll before not to mention that vague description of trolling would give potential to Mods interpreting it the way they want (i.e. what they or their friends post "isn't" trolling but what others post "is" trolling). Everyone flames at least a little bit and often times it's not a very conscious and deliberate violation of a healthy community. Arguments get heated. Spamming, however, is a conscious violation.

However, I don't think QFE's, bumps, or Inb4 Locks can hardly be considered spamming (largely to do with the fact they aren't "re-posting" content as described by your definition of "spamming") as they aren't (again) the same conscious violation as someone re-posting a thread over and over again.

If it's not too much to ask, I'd like to see some justification behind the specificity of some of these changes (such as the ones I mentioned above).

Colest
09-14-2010, 12:05 PM
Also... Call me crazy but I don't think I can edit my post (as I try not to double post).

But I take it our registration dates and sech won't transfer? I like seeing my registration as it reminds me how long I've been involved with the community.

khamsinvera
09-14-2010, 02:32 PM
All this could be solved by simply having a PvP forum where those who want to - can talk smack. Those who do not wish to participate in flame wars can chose to stay out.

It's supposed to be a sandbox game. Except now we are all expected to quietly sit down and make sand cookies with our government approved cookie cutters.

Kicking sand in the face of those who mess with us was part of the fun of SWG!

Maybe I'll get an infraction or the cooties for saying this but ... the new forum rules were probably lifted from the KGB rule book :P

All you're doing is repressing human nature and expecting folks to behave like protocol droids that are lathered in hand sanitizers every other minute

Sol Elo
09-14-2010, 03:26 PM
What would Han Solo do?

Colest
09-14-2010, 03:45 PM
What would Han Solo do?

Shoot first.

Uli
09-14-2010, 03:46 PM
Now do you actually agree with me or are you trying to make a point?

Both.

fixit6
09-14-2010, 07:40 PM
All this could be solved by simply having a PvP forum where those who want to - can talk smack. Those who do not wish to participate in flame wars can chose to stay out.

It's supposed to be a sandbox game. Except now we are all expected to quietly sit down and make sand cookies with our government approved cookie cutters.

Kicking sand in the face of those who mess with us was part of the fun of SWG!

Maybe I'll get an infraction or the cooties for saying this but ... the new forum rules were probably lifted from the KGB rule book :P

All you're doing is repressing human nature and expecting folks to behave like protocol droids that are lathered in hand sanitizers every other minute

Don't ever recall some the things people say here and often in game back in live. People were far more creative with their insults and rarely resorted to obscene language except maybe in tells. I can start posting screen shots of some the garbage that people say in Cnet if you want; we are talking about stuff that in retail games gets you PERMA BANs, yet here nothing happens...at all. Infact I dare say it's encouraged.

There is a line, dear sir, that should be drawn in that sand you talk about. Cross it, you get banned and I think a good portion of the community will cheer when it happens.

fixit6
09-14-2010, 08:00 PM
p.s. (since I cannot edit) I fully support a PvP section, lightly moderated so that all the need to create flamewars is placed there than in the TC one. Rivalry is ok in my books, but it needs a proper place for it.

TAfirehawk
09-14-2010, 08:17 PM
All this could be solved by simply having a PvP forum where those who want to - can talk smack. Those who do not wish to participate in flame wars can chose to stay out.

It's supposed to be a sandbox game. Except now we are all expected to quietly sit down and make sand cookies with our government approved cookie cutters.

Kicking sand in the face of those who mess with us was part of the fun of SWG!

Maybe I'll get an infraction or the cooties for saying this but ... the new forum rules were probably lifted from the KGB rule book :P

All you're doing is repressing human nature and expecting folks to behave like protocol droids that are lathered in hand sanitizers every other minute

We have a Role Playing forum (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=156) that is designed for most of what you are asking I believe. We are certainly open to creating new and needed areas if that helps the progress of development.


Also... Call me crazy but I don't think I can edit my post (as I try not to double post).

But I take it our registration dates and sech won't transfer? I like seeing my registration as it reminds me how long I've been involved with the community.

As far as I know right now and it isn't complete or fully tested yet, only your name, password and email will transfer. You bring up a good point that maybe we should look into transfering the registration dates as well, but I don't know what is possible or practical.


2 Weeks for spamming but 9 Months for trolling? I mean, I've seen Mods troll before not to mention that vague description of trolling would give potential to Mods interpreting it the way they want (i.e. what they or their friends post "isn't" trolling but what others post "is" trolling). Everyone flames at least a little bit and often times it's not a very conscious and deliberate violation of a healthy community. Arguments get heated. Spamming, however, is a conscious violation.

However, I don't think QFE's, bumps, or Inb4 Locks can hardly be considered spamming (largely to do with the fact they aren't "re-posting" content as described by your definition of "spamming") as they aren't (again) the same conscious violation as someone re-posting a thread over and over again.

If it's not too much to ask, I'd like to see some justification behind the specificity of some of these changes (such as the ones I mentioned above).

Those things are considered spam on the SWGEmu services. At the same time it is not our intention to exclude those helpful people from doing just that, helping development. I really don't think that the honest and helpful people will have any fear of being banned.

I will agree that the spam and trolling infraction lengths are not making the most sense right now. We will review this and feel free to bring these concerns up to concerns@swgemu.com

Vlada
09-14-2010, 08:38 PM
As far as I know right now and it isn't complete or fully tested yet, only your name, password and email will transfer. You bring up a good point that maybe we should look into transfering the registration dates as well, but I don't know what is possible or practical.

If that's the case then there is no point in keeping my name, all I am interested really is my registration date.

Please let us know if that is possible.

Max
09-14-2010, 09:29 PM
If that's the case then there is no point in keeping my name, all I am interested really is my registration date.

Please let us know if that is possible.
It should theoretically be possible, but we will have to talk to Polonel.

Lubbe
09-14-2010, 09:39 PM
Yeah it would be nice if we could keep the register day :o

PreCU_or_JarJar_Gets_it
09-14-2010, 09:47 PM
It should theoretically be possible, but we will have to talk to Polonel.

Please talk to him :) Have you any idea how annoying it is to type this username out every time I want to log in?

And yeah, I know... If I'd have known at the time that our forum handles and logins would be the same... Oy.

JuN_FaNg
09-14-2010, 10:56 PM
p.s. (since I cannot edit) I fully support a PvP section, lightly moderated so that all the need to create flamewars is placed there than in the TC one. Rivalry is ok in my books, but it needs a proper place for it.

A PvP section would have, like, 70% of the posts, since virtualy everything is a motive for a flame war in this forum, even the opening of a PvP section. :D

TAfirehawk
09-14-2010, 11:38 PM
I don't mean to speculate, but keeping your registration date would require keeping the same name....as far as I know.

A new account name is a totally new user. Getting your old registration date or anything else on your old account requires your current name and password. That information is then checked against the forum database and then copied over to the other services, including the new forum.

Shoryuu
09-15-2010, 01:44 AM
I'm sorry to say this, but this kind of infraction system makes me less interested in playing on this emulator for multiple reasons

A: Not being able to BUMP a trade forum post, resulting in it never being seen by the public after the first day or two.

B: 1.1 Multiple SWGEmu Accounts are not permitted. Each user may only have one account. Measures are incorporated to detect multiple user accounts. Please see the Account Issues Policy for help. 3 points, never expires

If a friend is shown the emulator and creates an account while he is at your house, bam you are now banned for another person not being informed.

C: 2.4 Troll posts or threads. We define troll posts and threads as those which knowingly lead to inflammatory or off-topic messages with the intent of A) provoking other users into a desired emotional response or B) disrupting normal on-topic discussion. 1 point, expires in 9 months

Players used to use the forums to start IN GAME PVP. If you have not noticed, this has gone on IN ORDER TO GET OTHER PLAYERS TO LOGIN TO PVP. It has worked against the following guilds STORM, PROST, NINE, NUA, C, DON, and EVERY other pvp guild. I have to ask, what would you consider a personal attack as someone was recently banned for using the word SLOTH (for a long period of time as well), I have to ask... Will you ever discuss the rule with the person before issuing the infraction? Or just assume they knew what line they crossed?

D: Will there ever be a point in time where these rules are relaxed as it seems these rules are going to do nothing but get people who act like themselves, and not act "FAKE" banned or removed from this emulator. Everyone knows people that get banned find another way to play again.

For what reason was a connection added between in game and on forums? Removing the ability to post, as it was in 14.1, would be a more effective tactic granted removing them from the game only makes it so the player gets even MORE enraged and likely just makes another account after being banned.

I guess the real question is, are you really going to emulate 14.1, or just your version of 14.1? During 14.1, forum bans were not linked to in game bans unless it was not a minor infraction.

Why are minor infractions linked to in game play? Minor infractions should only effect the forums and not time spent in game.

Shoryuu
09-15-2010, 01:48 AM
Forgot to add, Will personal vendettas between staff and players continue to hinder the play of certain players who to this day are still banned?

PoisonTaco
09-15-2010, 03:07 AM
Whatever helps keep you guys all organized. The easier it is for you guys to keep everything together the easier it will be for you guys to roll out the OR and eventually 1.0!

HeadyGlass
09-15-2010, 09:07 AM
I have to agree, I hate the sanctimonious bull that goes on in the forums.
I got infraction points for trying to point out that staff was inciting reactions, then I get jumped on by other staff saying they didn't deserve to be talked to like taht...etc. I got the infraction points for trying to point out spam, not name calling, just pointing out that what staff had said served no purpose other than to incite reactions, classic baiting spam, yet I get infractions and ask why and if others got them and never recieved a response.

Sorry to rant and rave, I just want others to know I have resentment towards these forums too.

khamsinvera
09-15-2010, 11:52 AM
We have a Role Playing forum (http://www.swgemu.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=156) that is designed for most of what you are asking I believe. We are certainly open to creating new and needed areas if that helps the progress of development.


I don't think (and I believe that most PvPers will agree) that PvP smack talk has anything to do with Role Playing.

If I'm calling someone a chicken, I'm NOT referring to someone who's standing around in coronet with a "Cluck Cluck" macro handing out Petrified Avian Eggs or Chicken Legs :rolleyes:

mmmm Chicken

Lobreeze
09-15-2010, 12:52 PM
lolol PvP forum != roleplay

Decius
09-15-2010, 01:02 PM
Everyone knows the emu staff cant take constructive criticism...

Lobreeze
09-15-2010, 01:10 PM
Everyone knows the emu staff cant take constructive criticism...

-staff +mods.

Having an opinion is a ban-able offence around here.

Neo1715
09-15-2010, 01:19 PM
I agree with these, for the most part. The only thing I disagree with is the insane lengths of time on some regarding forum posts. 1 point for 9 months for a troll post, 2 points for a year for a REPOST. That's the same amount of time Nova has been on TC, a bit harsh imo.

Borgboy
09-15-2010, 02:57 PM
Really liking these changes.

With the new forums, can we either get rid of or restrict the size of large images in people's signatures?

Colest
09-15-2010, 03:00 PM
As far as I know right now and it isn't complete or fully tested yet, only your name, password and email will transfer. You bring up a good point that maybe we should look into transfering the registration dates as well, but I don't know what is possible or practical.

Thanks. I like being reminded of how long you guys have been dangling this carrot in front of my face ;)

Those things are considered spam on the SWGEmu services. At the same time it is not our intention to exclude those helpful people from doing just that, helping development. I really don't think that the honest and helpful people will have any fear of being banned.

I would agree that they are considered spam in the sense that is a "needless, noncontributing post;" however, I don't think someone bumping their thread for further discussion should be penalized the same as someone repeatedly making threads about the same topic. That is just my opinion though.

I will agree that the spam and trolling infraction lengths are not making the most sense right now. We will review this and feel free to bring these concerns up to concerns@swgemu.com

Thank you sir. I'm glad to see a staff that takes into consideration its supporters concerns :)

Apex_
09-15-2010, 04:00 PM
I agree with these, for the most part. The only thing I disagree with is the insane lengths of time on some regarding forum posts. 1 point for 9 months for a troll post, 2 points for a year for a REPOST. That's the same amount of time Nova has been on TC, a bit harsh imo.

I would agree some of the rules could use further clarification. For example, "repost" in this case implies a thread or post that was deleted due to severely breaking the rules. Things like a blatant flame thread full of profanity and personal attacks would fall into this category, if it were deleted and the user made the same thread again.

We're still working out the kinks in the infraction system. These revised rules aren't set in stone, and despite some of the more jaded posters insisting the contrary we are open to critique. After all, community feedback is what led us to sit down and discuss rule revisions in the first place. :)

JaceBon
09-15-2010, 04:29 PM
Having an opinion is a ban-able offence around here.

This.

And my opinion is: less forum work more OR. Our forum works perfectly.

SomeoneImportant
09-15-2010, 04:54 PM
This.

And my opinion is: less forum work more OR. Our forum works perfectly.

I agree, the forums themselves were perfectly fine, hell..even the infractions and rules were fine.

The only issue ever had was terrible mods.

TAfirehawk
09-15-2010, 10:58 PM
The SWGEmu Team is making improvements that keep the focus on DEVELOPMENT as well as a pleasant place for all to come and interact.

The SWGEmu Team is listening and seriously considering all valid and feasible concerns. Emotions are now "checked at the door" as much as humanly possible (we are also people with feelings). Concerns and suggestions are most effective when sent to concerns@swgemu.com.

We are making some suggested adjustments to the rules and will be posting them shortly.

This thread is now closed.