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  #316  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:33 PM
Bostwain Bostwain is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cRush View Post
I'm not sure I understand the argument about how Ashor exploiting to Jedi first has interfered with testing ability. Why exactly does that hinder anyone's testing? Does it directly affect testing in some way that I am unaware?
Unless there is something in the middle of this thread that kyle posted saying ashor hacked to jedi I seriously think you guys need to sit down and have a conference.

Kyle is saying what ashor did did not affect him getting jedi sooner, yet other devs are seen saying contradicting statements.
  #317  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:37 PM
Timbab Timbab is offline
 
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Lol, Ashur IS banned again?

What now, unbanned, banned, unbanned, banned...
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  #318  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:38 PM
Kayliaah Kayliaah is offline
 
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Let's play ping pong.

Ban - unban - ban - unban - ban - unban - ban - unban !
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  #319  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:39 PM
sXeKJB sXeKJB is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by learningdisease View Post
Okay, Timbab, I'll play along.

Taking into account for all of the dramafests and "issues", and accepting that the decisions made up to this point, all combined and played out over the years have come to this moment, this whole argument of a modification of a rule for exploiters:
What does the community think?
What does the community feel is the appropriate course of action?
Is there a way we can appease both the community and the STAFF?

So far:

What does the community think?
50/50 or 40/60 split over "good idea to involve exploiters in testing" vs "exploiters should never be dealt with"

What does the community feel is the appropriate course of action?
This is where we have not had as much input from the community. Enough flaming, +1ing, and counterpointing. What would you have done were you in STAFF's position?

Is there a way we can appease both the community and STAFF?

I certainly think so.
Maybe the community wants Ashur perma-banned, but allow for the exploitation team.
Maybe the community will be okay with whatever STAFF decides.
All I know is, we need more constructive input from you guys if we are going to have this discussion.

If you feel in anyway that you would be persecuted for your opinions, feel free to PM me or ANY OTHER Blue Name here at the SWGEmu Forums, although I certainly hope that sort of atmosphere would not come to our community.

Please work with us in a constructive and mature manner, I'm sure we will all be able to come to a reasonable compromise.

Thanks.
I would feel more comfortable if this exploitation team was started from the ground up, have people submit some type of resume to assure they are knowledgeable about finding exploits and properly exploiting who are also trustworthy until proven otherwise, just like people have to submit to be apart of QA.

I don't like the idea of people who are known offenders of exploiting for the wrong reasons (even if they want to come back to do "good").

A well put together exploitation team that has members dedicated to finding exploits, and not veered off by jedi/irc/forum drama will be more effective I believe; maybe even keep them discrete, so the exploits aren't brought out into the wild.

Basically I'm all for the idea of a well constructed exploitation team, but I don't support bringing back people who have not been trustworthy.
  #320  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:39 PM
Uli Uli is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timbab View Post
Lol, Ashur IS banned again?

What now, unbanned, banned, unbanned, banned...

Obviously its because he has stated here that he will not co-operate and help the exploitation team and that is most likely due to the response the community have given him in this thread.
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  #321  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:40 PM
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learningdisease learningdisease is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timbab View Post
You do realize that the actual speedhacking isn't the problem with the majority right? The majority feel the staff can't be trusted since first they were banned, then they were made 'staff'.

From all the conflicts we and others had with the staff over the year it basically comes down to this:

A small group of staff acts on their believes, with out acting out of interest for the staff, but rather on what they think is best. This thread clearly showed proof in this instance on how the staff was hugely split on the subject and pushed out non the less.

The credibility just lacks in a lot of cases, when it comes to things such as this. A lot of things were happening in the background away from the public over the years which we clearly attacked on numerous times which caused 'drama'. This is probably the FIRST time that the staff tripped over their own mistake in public and almost killed off their credibility with it.

I don't think you personally should be discussing this, Learning, since it's a lot deeper than a few simple issues or what you've heard from our 'drama' over the years. I personally don't care anymore, but having this thread and basically the SAME issue that we've addressed a couple of times in public now, I just had to speak a few words.

You can counter me all you want, this thread proved a lot to the people and I should be the least of your worries, I'd rather look into the future and look how to prevent stuff like this happening again. But then again, I'm not staff, none of my business right?
This is a completely legitimate concern Timbab, and it is your business, as you are part of the community here. I'm not singling you out.

Instead of looking at this as a debacle, I hope we can look at it as a way to strengthen the bond of trust between STAFF and the community. The STAFF are taking a VERY introspective look at themselves after all of this, and now is the time to let STAFF know exactly what you think about it. We all take your concerns seriously, provided that they are brought up maturely and seriously as well.

Things are changing quickly in this project at this stage, we are snowballing towards something VERY monumental, and we don't want to discard any concerns.

I just want to put forth these ideas here now, and I hope that the community can understand when I say that the things the community brings up in this thread, or privately to any staff member you choose regarding these issues, will be taken VERY seriously.

Thats all I have left to say for this issue. Thanks to all the community members who have input their opinions and concerns in a mature fashion. I hope everyone will come to an understanding.
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  #322  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:43 PM
cRush cRush is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bostwain View Post
Unless there is something in the middle of this thread that kyle posted saying ashor hacked to jedi I seriously think you guys need to sit down and have a conference.

Kyle is saying what ashor did did not affect him getting jedi sooner, yet other devs are seen saying contradicting statements.
Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I was in no way inferring that Ashor hacked to Jedi. I was merely inquiring as to why, if he did, that it would be such a hindrance to testing as is so claimed throughout this thread.
  #323  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:46 PM
DraGa DraGa is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cRush View Post
Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I was in no way inferring that Ashor hacked to Jedi. I was merely inquiring as to why, if he did, that it would be such a hindrance to testing as is so claimed throughout this thread.
Because the simple fact that he hacked in ANY way shape and form on the TestCenter, and that it wasn't met with COMPLETE and UTTER distate is the problem right now.

The TestCenter is not only a test for code, but a test for the administration
BEHIND the project. Without the staff taking appropriate anti-hacker action, we simply CANNOT trust the staff whatsoever.
  #324  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:49 PM
zetlaux zetlaux is offline
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I couldn't refrain from posting some satire with my first response. This situation is so out there in contrast with everything else I've seen here in almost 3 years, it almost begged for at least an attempt at comic relief.

In the end, I know the developers and staff are all discussing this extensively. The public has spoken. They heard it. Now let's see what happens before we do anything else.
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  #325  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:50 PM
Gigabass Gigabass is offline
 
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My useless 2 cents: FBI has over time (and CIA if I remember correctly: just think, big companies or w/e that have been hacked) hired those who sucessfully entered their servers by whatever means to work for them and help them on their security issues. Some time ago same happened here on Portugal with the Police Department or such. Someone named Buzzybee hacked into their servers, and they eventually worked for them. Oh and a 15 or 16 kid entered FBI on something similar, too.
It IS necessary/saves dev team ALOT of work and time. That = faster 1.0 + less bugs/exploits.
Is it fair that they come back with no punishment? No, but it helps the project go faster...
Can they be trusted they won't **** up and spread these and blablabla? Sosko supposedly gave the hack pack out in IRC (possibly a trojan or such) and was in STORM... I heard all of storm was hackers and buddies but won't compare Sosko to other members.
So like yeah, it's a double-edged knife to have them cooperate. I'll leave the decision to the staff on what they think is best, they have already took this project so far, lol.

My 2 cents before I go study chemistry for an exam in 2 days while watching the jedai cave
  #326  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:52 PM
Cilraaz Cilraaz is offline
 
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Posts: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gigabass View Post
My useless 2 cents: FBI has over time (and CIA if I remember correctly: just think, big companies or w/e that have been hacked) hired those who sucessfully entered their servers by whatever means to work for them and help them on their security issues. Some time ago same happened here on Portugal with the Police Department or such. Someone named Buzzybee hacked into their servers, and they eventually worked for them. Oh and a 15 or 16 kid entered FBI on something similar, too.
It IS necessary/saves dev team ALOT of work and time. That = faster 1.0 + less bugs/exploits.
Is it fair that they come back with no punishment? No, but it helps the project go faster...
Can they be trusted they won't **** up and spread these and blablabla? Sosko supposedly gave the hack pack out in IRC (possibly a trojan or such) and was in STORM... I heard all of storm was hackers and buddies but won't compare Sosko to other members.
So like yeah, it's a double-edged knife to have them cooperate. I'll leave the decision to the staff on what they think is best, they have already took this project so far, lol.

My 2 cents before I go study chemistry for an exam in 2 days while watching the jedai cave
That brings us back to Timbab's hacker vs script kiddie argument. Hire the hacker. Kick the script kiddie in the nuts.
  #327  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:53 PM
Wolverine79 Wolverine79 is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kayliaah View Post
I still don't understand why you people are interested in his TC Jedi.

Sorry but what a bunch of retarded kids, I would triple slap you in the face if I could.
Its not about jedi. Its about hacking, exploiting and greifing. It just happen to be a jedi while he was doing it and covering up by calling it a jedi power.

Then having corrupted staff unbanned him and then make him a special friend title so he can cont. on. I am sorry but come on he was caught and him and other like him.

Also a deeper rooted corruption in staff letting this go on and people who report these exploiter, hackers and greifers we get threaten to be banned for it but the ones cheating is getting away with it and getting rewarded for it.
  #328  
Old 10-19-2009, 02:59 PM
DraGa DraGa is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
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Posts: 130


LOLOLOLOLOL according to IRC he was caught AGAIN hacking. Rumor is that his name has been changed however.
  #329  
Old 10-19-2009, 03:00 PM
Timbab Timbab is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Berlin, Germany
Posts: 4,312
LOLOLOLL Rumors.

The ban is quite obvious...
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  #330  
Old 10-19-2009, 03:00 PM
Rippster Rippster is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cRush View Post
Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I was in no way inferring that Ashor hacked to Jedi. I was merely inquiring as to why, if he did, that it would be such a hindrance to testing as is so claimed throughout this thread.
I can only speak for myself but I haven't tested in a week because the rubber-banding/lag is so bad. I'm simply unable to do anything other than harvest and even that becomes tedious trying to get to other resources.

My concern is that it seems this project has been sidetracked due to the actions of some hackers while everyone is having trouble testing the game. And on top of that, the wavering back and forth between promoting hackers, banning, not banning, etc., etc., is making me wonder just what exactly is going on here and affecting my ability to trust the staff.

To be frank, the instability and unsure direction of this project at the moment has myself and others leery of where things are headed. I suggest you all have a serious meeting (with ALL staff present) and come to some concrete conclusions about what the goals/future holds for SWGEmu.

It's difficult to trust our "leaders" when they're waffling on things and having internal issues.

Get everyone together, figure out what's best for SWGEmu, and get back to finishing the project instead of allowing things like this to derail the process.

Just my two creds, for what it's worth...or not worth...
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